Your next five to go into the HOF

MonsterNerd1986

Well-Known Member
MasterofTame "I know I only have a limited knowledge of pre-1987 monster trucks but"
that?s what museums are for, to educate and preserve the past with facts and historical objects. There are a number of issues with this HoF. First it was to be a time line that now has jumped years ahead leaving out many worth nominees. Alan Tura worked very hard in the sport and was one of the earlier innovators and went from leafer to race truck, robots, etc, he was an entertainer in the business and his name still seems to be overlooked in conversations. Second most HoF you have to be retired to be inducted, not this one. The Class of 2011 inductees one was a no brainer for who should be inducted. And the 2012 class of inductees I don?t agree with, at least two of them.

I do like the inductees at five to six inductees like most of HoF, it?s not a large inductee list. Why inductee a large class of drivers, what?s the rush. Everyone is so impatient anymore and can?t wait, maybe for 2013 they will just induct everyone in the industry and be done.
 

carcrusher

Well-Known Member
I disagree more with the notion that this whole thing is supposed to be a timeline. It's a Hall of Fame - the people who are inducted should be recognized for their overall contributions to the industry, not by when those contributions happened. That's like saying Earnhardt and Richard Petty didn't deserve to belong in the first class of the Nascar HOF because they weren't running shine in the '30s and '40s. It's a ridiculous mentality that should have been squashed from the get-go. I wouldn't be opposed to a pre-determined time of inactivity before eligibility like some other Hall of Fame situations (would be tough since so many deserving folks are still involved and it's a young sport), but beyond that, time should not be a factor at all.

I wholeheartedly agree with all of the choices made so far in the first two classes, and it's a reason why I'll be buying my ticket for next year as well. If you don't like it or don't agree, then don't go!
 

theace27

Well-Known Member
So Matt what you are saying is you wouldn't disagree to Tom Meents being inducted before David Spiker???
 

modeltruckshop

Well-Known Member
I disagree more with the notion that this whole thing is supposed to be a timeline. It's a Hall of Fame - the people who are inducted should be recognized for their overall contributions to the industry, not by when those contributions happened.
Luckily there is a Hall of Fame in Auburn, Indiana just like that. If you go to the Football Hall of Fame in Canton it is chronological, the Air Force museum and Hall of Fame in Dayton is chronological, baseball, Rock and Roll,bowling.......etc. If there is no chronological order is it just a popularity contest?? Sorry Russ Gearhart you might have been on military axles before Bigfoot but you din't sell enough T-shirts.....you don't count. Does that make sense????????????
Matt, I was on the nomination committee both years so far and the specific instruction we were given was that the nominations were to be in chronological order. Now ,granted that was all thrown out the window when a couple board memebers decided that won't sell enough tickets......but it was the originbal intent.
If the inductions are chronological how does the process go backwards? Tom Meents today is more popular than Seth Doulton today, so is Seth just out??? It makes no sense at all. Do potential inductees from the past face a time cutoff? Maybe it could just be made into a museum and Hall of Fame of anarchy? Total chaos.
I like Monsternerds idea, just put everyone in and be done with it. Pay $35 get your poster, a meal and your picture on a plaque.
The current attempt at a Hall of Fame/Museum was started without any sort of a plan, just work it out as it comes up. That helped create some of the mess, ego created some more and finances the rest. Don't take it too serious. Its not quite what alot of you think it is.
 

BiteMeStudios

Well-Known Member
Luckily there is a Hall of Fame in Auburn, Indiana just like that. If you go to the Football Hall of Fame in Canton it is chronological, the Air Force museum and Hall of Fame in Dayton is chronological, baseball, Rock and Roll,bowling.......etc. If there is no chronological order is it just a popularity contest?? Sorry Russ Gearhart you might have been on military axles before Bigfoot but you din't sell enough T-shirts.....you don't count. Does that make sense????????????
Matt, I was on the nomination committee both years so far and the specific instruction we were given was that the nominations were to be in chronological order. Now ,granted that was all thrown out the window when a couple board memebers decided that won't sell enough tickets......but it was the originbal intent.
If the inductions are chronological how does the process go backwards? Tom Meents today is more popular than Seth Doulton today, so is Seth just out??? It makes no sense at all. Do potential inductees from the past face a time cutoff? Maybe it could just be made into a museum and Hall of Fame of anarchy? Total chaos.
I like Monsternerds idea, just put everyone in and be done with it. Pay $35 get your poster, a meal and your picture on a plaque.
The current attempt at a Hall of Fame/Museum was started without any sort of a plan, just work it out as it comes up. That helped create some of the mess, ego created some more and finances the rest. Don't take it too serious. Its not quite what alot of you think it is.
I find the above to be unfortunate. I feel the Hall of Fame is a fantastic organization. As a member of the nominating and research committees, I don't agree with everything, but I do agree with it as a whole. There is no mess. Steve is right, it is not what you think. It is a whole lot better.
 

carcrusher

Well-Known Member
The intent of my post was disagreeing with the premise that it was to be chronological at all - it shouldn't have been presented to the nominating committee in the first place - it's a bad idea and will only cause the hall to self-destruct because the funding coming in just won't be there to sustain it.

So Matt what you are saying is you wouldn't disagree to Tom Meents being inducted before David Spiker???
I wouldn't disagree at all - Tom's contributions as a driver, chassis builder and being known to push boundaries, to me, is much more impressive than a multi-truck operation that rarely left the southeastern quadrant of the country. David Spiker did a lot in the day, but I don't feel that his accomplishments match (nor are they nearly as documented) as Tom's. It's ultimately the nominating committee's decision and I could honestly care less since I'll be there no matter who is being inducted.

If you think the R&R HOF is chronological in any way shape or form, you need to go to the nearest open MRI unit to have an examination.

Colby hit it right on the head - the HOF is way better than I could have ever expected. The two induction weekends have been more fun for me as a fan than any event, any display, and any shop visit that I've ever been to. It's given me a chance to meet my heros, both of yesterday and today, and I hope that it will only continue to grow. It also gives us fans a chance to interact with others that have similar interest and similar levels of obsession over this industry - an opportunity that doesn't come around often. Do I agree with the order of every induction? Surely not, but it's sure not going to make me upset at all - I go to support these guys because they've all worked hard in this industry and they all deserve recognition one way or another. And if someones' feelings are such that they think it's all a farce, then they can stay at home sucking on their sour grapes while the rest of us have fun.
 

theace27

Well-Known Member
Matt , Spiker's trucks did a lot more touring then what you think. All 3 trucks spent more time on the road then they did sitting in Fl. David's trucks all performed in every state and nearly every province in Canada. The All American was the first monster truck to be shown in France and the Eagle in Puerto Rico. Spikers had a multi truck team while most people at the time only had one truck. They had their toy deal with Nylint. The trucks were also to be featured in a major movie until funds ran out on that project. But what I am saying here is yes a lot of Spiker's history hasn't been documented but it was their help to the sport that pushed it along.
 

modeltruckshop

Well-Known Member
Matt , Spiker's trucks did a lot more touring then what you think. All 3 trucks spent more time on the road then they did sitting in Fl. David's trucks all performed in every state and nearly every province in Canada. The All American was the first monster truck to be shown in France and the Eagle in Puerto Rico. Spikers had a multi truck team while most people at the time only had one truck. They had their toy deal with Nylint. The trucks were also to be featured in a major movie until funds ran out on that project. But what I am saying here is yes a lot of Spiker's history hasn't been documented but it was their help to the sport that pushed it along.
There is the exact reason a museum should be accurate and not just thrown together. So people know a little more to the real story of trucks, drivers and owners not just what they have read on mayhem.
 

Kouvre

Well-Known Member
How about some more originators ? Jim Oldaker with Rollin thunder, cliff starbird had TWO popular machines. Spiker had three! Scott Stephans no doubt should have already been in. They need to stop with just drivers right now unless they had involvement in the design or progress of the truck. Rodney Litzou comes to mind for that. What about Jan Gabrial? He produced the first big shows to bring mt's to us on tv. Before we get to the TNT years, we are forgetting about the ten years before that.
While I agree originators belong in the HOF, just because someone had a truck or trucks doesn't mean they belong with the Hall of Fame. That's all I'm going to say about that without going into specifics. I do heartily agree future classes need to have more people included on the industry side such as Seth Doulton, Broadway Bob, and Bob George who were massively instrumental in the formative years of the industry.

My next five:

Bob George - Without him, there is no Monster Jam
Jon Breen - The first to debut a race-oriented monster truck
Rod Litzau - The first driver to win a championship series dedicated to monster truck racing
Scott Stephens - Founder of Texas Off-Road and campaigned one of the very first multi-truck teams.
Seth Doulton - Promoter of the very first monster truck race

Fifteen others who should make the list of nominees at the very least:

Allen Pezo
Andy Brass
Army Armstrong
Bill Townes
Billy Joe Miles
Broadway Bob (what's his last name?)
Dan Patrick
Dave Marquart
David Morris
Diehl Wilson
Gary Cook
Gary Porter
Mike Gallaway
Kirk Dabney
Rich Hooser
 
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theace27

Well-Known Member
Broadway Bob Metzler. I had the privilege to meet Bob back in 2006. What was interesting about our encounter was that he sot me out while at the National Hot Rod Reunion to check out my 1970 Fargo A-100. As soon as he walked up I knew right away I was in the presents of a legend. Bob was a super nice guy to chat with, his stories were great. Sadly we lost Bob this past summer at age 83. I totally agree with you Kouvre, Bob did a lot for promoting monster trucks over the years.
 

MonsterNerd1986

Well-Known Member
I wholeheartedly agree with all of the choices made so far in the first two classes, and it's a reason why I'll be buying my ticket for next year as well. If you don't like it or don't agree, then don't go!
This thread is better then the HoF historian discussion, or was that Q&A? Matt, how many trips do you figure you have made to Auburn since the HoF opened in 2010, or do you only attend banquets? You also probally feel that Mark Dye doesnt deserve to be nominated either, because he sayed mostly in the southwest. He "does" deserve to be nominated because his truck was far ahead of its time.
 

modeltruckshop

Well-Known Member
As someone that was 100% behind the museum to start with, and had waited many years for this to start I was very honored to get to help both at the museum and with the selection both years. Myself I thought the first year the choices were the best possible for an inuagral group. I was in total agreement with all of them.

For the second year it was not as smooth. I don't want to be the one to say "There is no Santa Clause" but the process failed as far as I am concerned this year. Although I think every person nominated this year is Hall of Fame worthy,I think the time line of the nominees makes no sense. A huge but not diverse nominating committee was asssembled but with very little direction. It became clear early on that the "timeline" was being thrown out the window. When these decisions were questioned they were quickly dismissed and never dealt with as a group. I talked to two of the board members MANY times with no luck and talked to 3 of last years nominees very often as well about the process and direction or lack there of. Once again none of it was dealt with. The nominating rules were frequently changed and straight answers very hard to come by.

As most people would guess Dennis brought the most contreversy, we were told early on the tractor tired trucks do not count, or years mud racing and car crushing with tractor tires, BUT for Dennis they would. The board determined that Dennis had 66's in 1985. We all know his first set was from Quadzilla/Blue Thunder, Blue Thunder was at the Silverdome with those tires still on it in November of 1985. So it must have been VERY late 1985 he got them eh??? The same tires and wheels appear in a picture still at Dabney's shop in April of 1986. So apparently his tractor tired years count, BUT Cyclops is not recognized as a monstyer truck by the board, as well as Krimson Krusher 1, MudLord etc... Or Brutte Boss Hogg. Muchless a truck like MUDRAT and his 66" terra tires.

Pablo presented the same glitch in the "timeline". The board determined they were campaining the ELIMINATOR truck in 1982 but Scott himself said it was named after the ZZ Top album which debuted in March of 1983........once again the rules were adjusted to fit the need. Somehow Scott was totally skipped over...............................

Several other similar problems unfolded but it quicky became a dictatorship and not a democracy. As I said above every one of this years guys should go in but the original intenet to my understanding was chronologicaly. Now what happens does the nomination go backwards or just tell the Pezo's,Doulton's,Townes and Tura's of the world too bad????? I have broad enough shoulders to take the flaming to follow but I for one tried to take this very serious and research it very seriously. That did not fit the marketing and financial needs of the museum as many of you have probably noticed. It is too bad because it is a great idea and something our sport needs for sure. For now it just needs the word ENTERTAINMENT added after the logo as far as I am concerned though, for whatever that may be worth. All of the "sour grapes" people should go back and check my past post showing the total support of the museum,helping both with displays, doantions, work on the trucks and help to promote the museum and what it was built for. See what I had done there first, Then start the flaming.............. Thanks,Steve
Wow Matt it only took four weeks for someone to say I had "sour grapes" just i like I expected. HA HA Thanks.

I completely agree with you and Colby that the banquet weekends are a great way to meet drivers young and old and swap stories and add to the autograph collection. I have enjoyed them as well.
Why not actually take some time and volunteer, drive to Auburn on a weekend that isn't the banquet. Helpout, donate items or your time or money. There is plenty of room for displaying whatever you would like to bring. Maybe you can find out why the donated motors don't go in GOLIATH or why the body from HERCULES was sold and never replaced so it is just a bare frame now? The building is rent free and no utilities. There are no purchases for display made, every item is donated. Trucks don't get restored. You can figure out where the money goes. The museum needs workers just like you. They are always looking for people that are "eager to help." You'll get in for free everytime you go to work. If you do enough you can even make it up onstage like I did. I'll make it easy. Send me your address and I will send you all my unused cards and a plaque. You will feel like part of the team. Just please don't act like you know what goes on there or how it operates when you don't. Anyone can pay $35 and go one night a year. Try helping out the other 364. Help make it more than a one night stand.
Of all the people here that are so excited about it, how many have ever made a trip there besides banquet weekend??? I actually have, lots and lots of times. It can be a heck of alot of fun. You will get to drive monster trucks, work on monster trucks and visit a monster truck shop in person,update the website. Get backstage,help out. Someone has to do it. Let us all know how it goes. I look forward to reading about it and enjoying the pictures here.





 

carcrusher

Well-Known Member
Actually I've been gathering up things to send to Jeff within the next few weeks to be put on display. I have a lot of stuff that people don't have, nor do most know that it ever existed, and I want other people to be able to enjoy that rather than the stuff sitting in boxes or on a shelf in my house. Heck, at this year's induction, Dennis, Adam and Ryan all asked me about a Digger product on my table that they couldn't remember even being made.

I'd love to come help out, but as a 23-year old single homeowner with a full time job and racing that takes up 45 weekends a year, it doesn't exactly allow me the time or money to make a 6-hour one way drive plus hotel fees for a weekend when I'm struggling to break even as it is. One trip to the HOF costs me approx. $300 between gas and 2 nights stay. Yeah I'll be right out.

You're right - I don't know what goes on or how it works, and it's not my place to because I prefer to be a fan and enjoy myself and enjoy the events on my terms. I used to race my R/C cars for fun, and while I still love it, now it's a second job to me due to my responsibilities in that industry. I can't afford to have the other hobby I've had my whole life (Monster Trucks) go in the same direction.

To those trying to throw names at me as to who I think who should or shouldn't be in - I truly don't care and neither should you. I have my opinions and you have yours - they don't have to be the same, neither is right or wrong. That's the nominating committee's job, not mine. You're preaching to the wrong choir. I'll be there no matter who's in because I support the idea.
 

MonsterNerd1986

Well-Known Member
I'd love to come help out, but as a 23-year old single homeowner with a full time job and racing that takes up 45 weekends a year, it doesn't exactly allow me the time or money to make a 6-hour one way drive plus hotel fees for a weekend when I'm struggling to break even as it is. One trip to the HOF costs me approx. $300 between gas and 2 nights stay. Yeah I'll be right out.
Thats good news to hear your "eager to help" but your booked, like everyone else you have other interest. BUT you can work from your home you don't have to go their. I along with others above, have countless hours at home and a number of trips there at my own expence.

To those trying to throw names at me as to who I think who should or shouldn't be in - I truly don't care and neither should you. I have my opinions and you have yours - they don't have to be the same, neither is right or wrong. That's the nominating committee's job, not mine. You're preaching to the wrong choir. I'll be there no matter who's in because I support the idea.
As far as you staying you dont care and neither should i, you do, we all do, maybe we care to much thats why were all trying to make points on something we love.
 
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MasterofTame

Well-Known Member
that’s what museums are for, to educate and preserve the past with facts and historical objects. There are a number of issues with this HoF. First it was to be a time line that now has jumped years ahead leaving out many worth nominees. Alan Tura worked very hard in the sport and was one of the earlier innovators and went from leafer to race truck, robots, etc, he was an entertainer in the business and his name still seems to be overlooked in conversations. Second most HoF you have to be retired to be inducted, not this one. The Class of 2011 inductees one was a no brainer for who should be inducted. And the 2012 class of inductees I don’t agree with, at least two of them.

I do like the inductees at five to six inductees like most of HoF, it’s not a large inductee list. Why inductee a large class of drivers, what’s the rush. Everyone is so impatient anymore and can’t wait, maybe for 2013 they will just induct everyone in the industry and be done.
I will goto it when I get the chance to do so. I thank having a history segment is great. Not everyone into it know the past or know every detail like many of us that talk about the Spikers, the Dyes and others who were around in the early days but dropped out by the boomtime. The point I was making in my previous post is that 1987 was the boom year as you had USHRA and TNT have the earliest racing schedules that would later lead to points racing and the modern day. To me, it is more important to have the people that helped leave a legacy into the monster trucks we know today than to people who were around in the 80's but for all intents and purposes had a little legacy. I like the looks of the Spanier trucks (Master of Disaster and Barely Tame) as well as the Fisher trucks but I would not say either driver is high on my list of inductees over those like a Tom Meents in his 20 year career or David Morris the driver(and later owner/driver) of Eqaulizer.

What does surprise me is the fact you said 2012 class members you disagree with. I don't think any I would disagree with any and others on the board don't. It went from the 80's boom and into the modern era if you look at all of them as Welch ran shows into the 2000's with modern trucks. The problem is we can all think of many drivers that either chronologically need to be in due to the genesis OR there are personalities that had a bigger impact that left a bigger legacy. Look at Kramer, he was basically the grandfather of racing and innovated for years even though his driving career was short however no person would not say his legacy is one of the most important in the sport. I'd put him as the second/third guy that should be in the hall but guess what, he was the 7th if I am not mistaken.
 
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BiteMeStudios

Well-Known Member
I will goto it when I get the chance to do so. I thank having a history segment but the point I was making is that 1987 was the boom year as you had USHRA and TNT have the earliest racing schedules that would later lead to points racing and the modern day. To me, it is more important to have the people that helped leave a legacy into the monster trucks we know today than to people who were around in the 80's but for all intents and purposes had a little legacy. I like the looks of the Spanier trucks (Master of Disaster and Barely Tame) as well as the Fisher trucks but I would not say either driver is high on my list of inductees over those like a Tom Meents in his 20 year career or David Morris the driver(and later owner/driver) of Eqaulizer.

What does surprise me is the fact you said 2012 class members you disagree with. I don't think any I would disagree with any and others on the board don't. It went from the 80's boom and into the modern era if you look at all of them as Welch ran shows into the 2000's with modern trucks. The problem is we can all think of many drivers that either chronologically need to be in due to the genesis OR there are personalities that had a bigger impact that left a bigger legacy. Look at Kramer, he was basically the grandfather of racing and innovated for years even though his driving career was short.
As an aside: Ok, enough of all the whining. The HOF is bigger than any one member of any part of it. Now to address the awesome post above...

Thank you, MasterofTame (or Michael, if I may call you by your name), for getting to some actual history discussion...because this one hits close to home for me:

Its kind of funny. I totally agree in that 1986/87 are my favorite years in terms of monster trucks. The first couple years of racing made for some VERY interesting events. However, being the video researcher for the HOF does lend itself to me seeing some incredible video from the very early days of the sport. I can tell you 100% that monster trucks were already on a downturn attendance-wise by that point. While TV exposure was finally there, live attendance was terrible. Don't buy it? look at the stands for, say, the Buffalo,NY event in 1987. It is empty. I mean, like 85% empty. Actually look in the upper decks in the Pontiac show from that same year. The TNT stuff in the big domes? Indianapolis? The upper deck is almost empty. Now, compare that to the footage of Bigfoot in Pontiac for the first car crush there. Find empty seats? I have seen footage of a Superdome show with Foot 2 crawling up on two cars just like the Pontiac show, and that place is PACKED. Pictures of the Pontiac shows in 84, 85...packed. Small arena shows...PACKED. look at the crowd on the St. Louis Arena show in 1988. LOTS of yellow seats showing through.

The "boom year" of 1987 was only a boom year in terms of the gigantic step forward monster trucks took in competition. It really began to weed out the trucks like the Spiker trucks, which while really pretty, weren't built to compete. The notion that they were 'campaigned' is a bit far-fetched to me, since they never progressed, then withered and died. They were basically not seen anymore after that point. Modern Day Outlaw (Ms/Lil' All American) is the only of those trucks I have seen in video after 1986 or 87. I am sure it exists, but at nowhere near the level to which the sport progressed. Guys like Diehl Wilson (whom I think is a sure-fire HOF'er in the next two years) showed that their trucks could continue to hang. The Dabney's, Foot, Daulton, Porter, Anderson...all stepped it up and were able to continue to compete. Despite all that, attendance had dropped BIG TIME at the major events shown on TV. If the same thing happened today, and MJ on Speed showed 3/4 empty stadiums, I know of more than a few in this thread alone that would be all over it as "proof" of their "theories".
 

chopper

Well-Known Member
Nothing in this world is perfect or will please everybody but for me, I am very happy with and thankful for all the effort that goes into the HOF. Thank you to all that contribute your time, out of pocket expenses amd items for the museum. While I feel it is important to get the early pioneers inducted it is not important so much to me as what order the inductions happen. It is 1400 miles roundtrip for me so donating time other than the banquet is not likely though I have donated items for the museum both times I attended and will again next year. I know Mike Welch plans to attend every year as he feels all inductee's and legends should return to show support for the HOF and new inductee's to the HOF. It was a bit disappointing more of the 1st year inductee's did not return for the 2nd HOF ceremony.
 

MasterofTame

Well-Known Member
As an aside: Ok, enough of all the whining. The HOF is bigger than any one member of any part of it. Now to address the awesome post above...

Thank you, MasterofTame (or Michael, if I may call you by your name), for getting to some actual history discussion...because this one hits close to home for me:

Its kind of funny. I totally agree in that 1986/87 are my favorite years in terms of monster trucks. The first couple years of racing made for some VERY interesting events. However, being the video researcher for the HOF does lend itself to me seeing some incredible video from the very early days of the sport. I can tell you 100% that monster trucks were already on a downturn attendance-wise by that point. While TV exposure was finally there, live attendance was terrible. Don't buy it? look at the stands for, say, the Buffalo,NY event in 1987. It is empty. I mean, like 85% empty. Actually look in the upper decks in the Pontiac show from that same year. The TNT stuff in the big domes? Indianapolis? The upper deck is almost empty. Now, compare that to the footage of Bigfoot in Pontiac for the first car crush there. Find empty seats? I have seen footage of a Superdome show with Foot 2 crawling up on two cars just like the Pontiac show, and that place is PACKED. Pictures of the Pontiac shows in 84, 85...packed. Small arena shows...PACKED. look at the crowd on the St. Louis Arena show in 1988. LOTS of yellow seats showing through.

The "boom year" of 1987 was only a boom year in terms of the gigantic step forward monster trucks took in competition. It really began to weed out the trucks like the Spiker trucks, which while really pretty, weren't built to compete. The notion that they were 'campaigned' is a bit far-fetched to me, since they never progressed, then withered and died. They were basically not seen anymore after that point. Modern Day Outlaw (Ms/Lil' All American) is the only of those trucks I have seen in video after 1986 or 87. I am sure it exists, but at nowhere near the level to which the sport progressed. Guys like Diehl Wilson (whom I think is a sure-fire HOF'er in the next two years) showed that their trucks could continue to hang. The Dabney's, Foot, Daulton, Porter, Anderson...all stepped it up and were able to continue to compete. Despite all that, attendance had dropped BIG TIME at the major events shown on TV. If the same thing happened today, and MJ on Speed showed 3/4 empty stadiums, I know of more than a few in this thread alone that would be all over it as "proof" of their "theories".
It's fine to call me Michael. And you're welcome. The history is always intriguing because even the best of us have a hole or two in our memories.

I think that is a point that we all need to remember. There are a lot of drivers who were in the mid to late days of the stage 1 trucks. Mad Dog and Bigfoot VI were arguably the first two purposed racers that existed with lighter bodies and chassis built for speed. (Bigfoot IV was later retro-fitted to run in 1987/8 if I remember the history correctly.) The fact is Dabneys continued innovention with Kirk making Duraliner Giant out of Blue Thunder and it was competitive for some time as a racer while his brother made the Alien and Hustler trucks. Everett made the USA-1 racer for TNT in 1988 and despite starting the year late, beat Bigfoot for the points title. The Danes changed their Kongs into racers and eventually just ran Awesome Kong due to them running independent despite being successful until the Awesome Kong flip with both Awesome and King Kong in TNT. Dennis Anderson eventually survived due to one of the most iconic trucks. Daulton created the very successful AM/PM trucks and later the Ecology Eliminator which was one of the more competitive stage 2 trucks into the early stage 3 days. Pezo had Lone Eagle his stage 1 Predator 1 (and 2) his stage 2 truck(s), the Predator Trax (which he drove for sometime) his tracked vehicle and then started one of the more known independent teams for some time with Predator, Prowler and later Pouncer. Porter campaigned his Carolina Crusher into the late 90's under his own going from a stage 1 to stage 3 which is hard to do. Stephens started in the early days and always innovated whether it was the jet trucks or the computerized Auto Value King Krunch Special. I honestly think this is something that should be weighted more than say oh Bubba made the fifth truck to crush cars but he only had his truck in Arizona and never appeared on television but he was the fifth truck to crush cars...
 

BiteMeStudios

Well-Known Member
I honestly think this is something that should be weighted more than say oh Bubba made the fifth truck to crush cars but he only had his truck in Arizona and never appeared on television but he was the fifth truck to crush cars...
I tend to agree with you, Michael. While I personally love the earliest stuff I can find, just because it was early doesn't mean it was ground-breaking or noteworthy. While there are wings of every hall of fame that show a timeline of the sport/activity/whatever, to be actually inducted into that hall is for the very select few who were/are the very best at what they do. I think there needs to be a place in our (by our, I mean us monster truck fans) Hall of Fame that points out and acknowledges those who were the very first to do something that was significant to the industry. That being said, if that person never won a race, or never even performed at a major event, do they still get in? Do they induct a guy who, in a backyard in Sheboygan had figured out how to throw the first curve ball, into the MLB Hall? No. They were some guy in a backyard who stumbled upon something that happened to work.

If you haven't been to the HOF website, or just missed this section, the guidelines that we nominating committee members are supposed to use are listed here: http://monstermuseum.org/hall-of-fame/ It is at the bottom of the page under the heading "Hall of Fame Eligibility". This is the way it was from the beginning, at least in official emails from the board I have received. There are certain keywords that sum up eligibility into the MT HOF. Contributions...no doubt, something like driveline brakes (Jasmer) is a major contribution. But that is not the only criteria that need to be considered. If Mr. Jasmer only did that, but his truck did a few local shows and ran the sand dunes down the road, that simply isn't enough for me to call him a HOF'er. He is in because of the next criteria. Accomplishments...well, this is a competition sport. To me, this means wins. It also means records and championships. For example, take Mark Hall, who has won more series championships than any other driver in the history of the sport. He started in 1988. Gary Porter is another one. He has won countless events and is still going to this day. "Consideration should be given to their entire body of work" To me, this implies longevity as well. No one makes any hall of fame without performing at a high level, but also without doing so for a long period of time.

The criteria also mention that all aspects of the sport should be considered. A current HOF'er in the late George Carpenter is a prime example. He was there from the beginning with USHRA in the late 70's. He continued promoting shows up until 2010. Most everything he touched was golden. However, one guy who I believe should go in this coming year is Seth Daulton. Seth not only built a ton of high tech (contribution), highly successful (accomplishment) trucks, but was a very successful promoter of shows as well. I have seen footage of Seth's shows from all the way out in Indiana. He branched out of the west for sure. Mike Vaters...another highly successful, long time driver who promotes great events every year. No brainers the both of them...at least to me.

The second bullet point is timeline. I do feel this is important, as it allows for a guy like Gary Porter, whom everyone agree should be in, to not be passed by in favor of Tom Meents. No doubt, Tom belongs in, but Gary came first and is just as deserving. That said, what does chronology mean (in a broader sense...I have been privy to enough of the talks to know why chronology was "really" important, but that ship has already sailed) if the truck never left the local sand dunes? Dennis finished the red primer Grave Digger in 1982. But, if the truck never left the mud bog, he wouldn't belong in our monster truck hall of fame, now would he? Now, the argument has been made that certain contributions are so important that they alone make a HOF'er. The guy who invented the baseball glove (Doug Allison, for the record, with the 1869 Reds) is not in their Hall of Fame. Is that not a major technological contribution to the game? But, he was an otherwise non-noteworthy player. Does he simply get in because he was a player in 1869? This is a prime example of the "entire body of work" clause in the eligibility statement we have. It is also a prime example of why chronology is listed second. I have seen "that truck was way ahead of its time" said I don't know how many time on this board over the five and a half years I have been here. Prove it. What did that truck/driver combination win? Where the innovations still being used today? Can you prove that without them, the idea wasn't just around the corner anyways? (Taurus racer and Foot 8 being a specific example here) If they never won a race with this "futuristic truck" in 1987, then what possible evidence can you bring that the truck was "ahead of its time"?

More thought goes into this for most of us involved than simply "they were first". More thought goes into the process than "he was my favorite". This is an honor for me, and one I do not take lightly. There are a lot of friends of mine that I know would be honored to be in, but unless they were truly worthy, I wouldn't feel right nominating them. No bias towards any time period, or size of team, or any other bias comes into my decision. I am looking at my 2013 list right now. Yes, I have already started researching for next year. I take this that seriously. On my list are people from big teams and people from single truck teams. There are close friends and people I have never met. One thing I am 100% confident of, is that anyone who looks at this process objectively, even if they don't agree, will at least say "Well, I may not agree, but it wouldn't be an insult to the integrity of the Hall for them to be in it."
 

GearhartEng

Well-Known Member
I tend to agree with you, Michael. While I personally love the earliest stuff I can find, just because it was early doesn't mean it was ground-breaking or noteworthy. While there are wings of every hall of fame that show a timeline of the sport/activity/whatever, to be actually inducted into that hall is for the very select few who were/are the very best at what they do. I think there needs to be a place in our (by our, I mean us monster truck fans) Hall of Fame that points out and acknowledges those who were the very first to do something that was significant to the industry. That being said, if that person never won a race, or never even performed at a major event, do they still get in? Do they induct a guy who, in a backyard in Sheboygan had figured out how to throw the first curve ball, into the MLB Hall? No. They were some guy in a backyard who stumbled upon something that happened to work.

If you haven't been to the HOF website, or just missed this section, the guidelines that we nominating committee members are supposed to use are listed here: http://monstermuseum.org/hall-of-fame/ It is at the bottom of the page under the heading "Hall of Fame Eligibility". This is the way it was from the beginning, at least in official emails from the board I have received. There are certain keywords that sum up eligibility into the MT HOF. Contributions...no doubt, something like driveline brakes (Jasmer) is a major contribution. But that is not the only criteria that need to be considered. If Mr. Jasmer only did that, but his truck did a few local shows and ran the sand dunes down the road, that simply isn't enough for me to call him a HOF'er. He is in because of the next criteria. Accomplishments...well, this is a competition sport. To me, this means wins. It also means records and championships. For example, take Mark Hall, who has won more series championships than any other driver in the history of the sport. He started in 1988. Gary Porter is another one. He has won countless events and is still going to this day. "Consideration should be given to their entire body of work" To me, this implies longevity as well. No one makes any hall of fame without performing at a high level, but also without doing so for a long period of time.

The criteria also mention that all aspects of the sport should be considered. A current HOF'er in the late George Carpenter is a prime example. He was there from the beginning with USHRA in the late 70's. He continued promoting shows up until 2010. Most everything he touched was golden. However, one guy who I believe should go in this coming year is Seth Daulton. Seth not only built a ton of high tech (contribution), highly successful (accomplishment) trucks, but was a very successful promoter of shows as well. I have seen footage of Seth's shows from all the way out in Indiana. He branched out of the west for sure. Mike Vaters...another highly successful, long time driver who promotes great events every year. No brainers the both of them...at least to me.

The second bullet point is timeline. I do feel this is important, as it allows for a guy like Gary Porter, whom everyone agree should be in, to not be passed by in favor of Tom Meents. No doubt, Tom belongs in, but Gary came first and is just as deserving. That said, what does chronology mean (in a broader sense...I have been privy to enough of the talks to know why chronology was "really" important, but that ship has already sailed) if the truck never left the local sand dunes? Dennis finished the red primer Grave Digger in 1982. But, if the truck never left the mud bog, he wouldn't belong in our monster truck hall of fame, now would he? Now, the argument has been made that certain contributions are so important that they alone make a HOF'er. The guy who invented the baseball glove (Doug Allison, for the record, with the 1869 Reds) is not in their Hall of Fame. Is that not a major technological contribution to the game? But, he was an otherwise non-noteworthy player. Does he simply get in because he was a player in 1869? This is a prime example of the "entire body of work" clause in the eligibility statement we have. It is also a prime example of why chronology is listed second. I have seen "that truck was way ahead of its time" said I don't know how many time on this board over the five and a half years I have been here. Prove it. What did that truck/driver combination win? Where the innovations still being used today? Can you prove that without them, the idea wasn't just around the corner anyways? (Taurus racer and Foot 8 being a specific example here) If they never won a race with this "futuristic truck" in 1987, then what possible evidence can you bring that the truck was "ahead of its time"?

More thought goes into this for most of us involved than simply "they were first". More thought goes into the process than "he was my favorite". This is an honor for me, and one I do not take lightly. There are a lot of friends of mine that I know would be honored to be in, but unless they were truly worthy, I wouldn't feel right nominating them. No bias towards any time period, or size of team, or any other bias comes into my decision. I am looking at my 2013 list right now. Yes, I have already started researching for next year. I take this that seriously. On my list are people from big teams and people from single truck teams. There are close friends and people I have never met. One thing I am 100% confident of, is that anyone who looks at this process objectively, even if they don't agree, will at least say "Well, I may not agree, but it wouldn't be an insult to the integrity of the Hall for them to be in it."
My name is Russ Gearhart are you referring to me as some guy who stumbled upon some thing in his backyard that worked.If you are talking about me than call me by my name.
 
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